Parselmouth

[prillalar]

Thanks, everyone, for weighing in on yesterday's epithets question. Some interesting stuff! I'll be replying to comments later on today. Here's another question, but specific to the story I'm writing, which is a Prince of Tennis piece, specifically MomoKai.

It's from Momo's POV and I settled on using "Momoshiro" once at the beginning and then "Momo" from then on. He seems to identify quite strongly with his nickname, so I think that will work fine. Today's dilemma is over what Momo calls Kaidoh. I don't mean in the narrative -- "Kaidoh" is just fine. And, really, we all know what Momo calls Kaidoh. My dilemma stems from whether to write it in English -- "viper" -- or Japanese -- "mamushi".

I try to avoid using fangirl Japanese in anime stories. Frankly, it makes me twitch. But there are some things that are necessary, like honourifics and titles. For example, I decided that I would use "buchou" when it's a form of address and "captain" when it's part of the narrative:

"I will love you forever, buchou, no matter what you did," Ryoma said, when he found out Tezuka had been removed as captain after his drug-dealing was discovered.

With Momo and Kaidoh, though, it seems much less clear-cut. In fact, no matter which I type -- viper or mamushi -- it looks weird to me. I guess I'm trying to figure out which is less weird.

If you've used one or the other, which did you pick and why? Which would you feel was more natural to read in fanfic? And would you capitalize it or not?

And while I've got you here, does anyone want to give me a character beta on this when it's done? (Hopefully in the next few days.) I anticipate not more than 2500 words, probably less. I feel like I could use a second opinion on whether I've kept these two in character.

(Christ, is there anything else I can do to procrastinate on actually writing this damn thing? Cut my toenails, I guess...)

Comments

[annotated_em]

How about a looser translation of 'mamushi' than simply 'viper'? Like, 'You snakey bastard' or something, to capture more of the feeling behind the epithet?

Or possibly I'm just on my own planet today, and you needn't mind me.

[prillalar]

Hee! I like this! I'm thinking I'll go with Emily's suggestion for the dialogue, but this might be fun to use in Momo's thoughts. Damn that snakey bastard, Momo thought. How dare he come to bowling dressed like a rent boy! Didn't he know what that would *do* to Momo?

[annotated_em]

[snickers] Glad to be of service!

[snickers some more at the image of that snakey bastard dressed as a rent boy]

Kaidoh: [blushes]

[prillalar]

I've got to say, that's exactly what Kaidoh looks like in that episode! (Clearly, I've never got over it. *g*) It was the vest -- not just the usual arm porn, but the manly cleavage and the bare midriff and the zipper that says, Don't you want to be the one to pull me down?

So, supertext: fanservice, text: nothing, subtext: obviously the boy wants to catch *someone's* eye. But whom?

[annotated_em]

Heh, now notions of everyone on the Seigaku team secretly lusting after the poor (and oblivious, of course, for added comedic value) boy.

[snickers]

Kaidoh: Why do you hate me, Em?

Oishi: This isn't hate. This is her twisted definition of love.

[prillalar]

Stay away from the scary lady, Kaidoh honey, and come over here with me. You know I'll never be mean to you.

*writes ten pages of InuKai snuggling*

All better now?

[branchandroot]

*indecisive* That's a tough one. I think I would come down on the side of Mamushi, capitalized and not italicized. It is just about a proper name, the way Momo uses it. And I do think there are somewhat different connotations to the word in Japanese than there would be to calling someone a snake in English.

*shakes head* Anything else just sounds way too Stan Lee in my mind's ear.

If you do decide on a translation, I'm with Em on the translating loosely thing.

*takes a moment to snicker over your example sentence*

[prillalar]

Yeah, I think you've got the right idea. It's difficult either way, but I think people will be more used to Mamushi. Thanks!

[greenet.livejournal.com]

One of the chapters in PoT manga 2 was called Adder's Tooth.. or something. Adder -something. Yeah.

Anyway, in a totally unrelated matter, that made me think of Kaidoh as Black Adder, which is horribly amusing when you're me.

Also? Tezuka the drug-dealer? must be written.

[greenet.livejournal.com]

Um. I meant, totally unrelated to your problems.

Personally, I have no problems with either Mamushi or Viper, but then I've spent the last ten years reading X-Men fanfic, so.

[prillalar]

OK, you will *pay* for making me think of Kaidoh as Edmund. While they are both entirely beautiful, they are as similar as two completely dissimilar things in a pod.

I think Tezuka the drug dealer would work better as part of a PoT rpg. Everyone can have shadey connections. Oishi can be a pimp. Inui is the king of racketeering, with Kaidoh as his collections man. Etc, etc.

[greenet.livejournal.com]

Now see what your brain does as you attempt to think of Inui and Baldrick... *cough*

I think Tezuka the drug dealer would work better as part of a PoT rpg.

Ryoma the man behind it all? Capo di tutti capo Echizen?

[jaebi-lit.livejournal.com]

I generally avoid fangirl Japanese like the plague, too, and it's only after some struggling that I gave up and used the honorific endings, -senpai, and aniki because English just doesn't convey the nuances of the relationships.

I think 'Viper' looks weird just because it sounds odd, but as 'mamushi' doesn't carry any special connatations aside from its actual meaning, there's no reason to use the Japanese. It would be a little odder to read Viper than mamushi, but that's because mamushi and 'baka mamushi' are fandom habits, if annoying ones.

[prillalar]

I think I'll go with Mamushi as the lesser of two evils. Fanfic is such an odd duck in this regard -- I don't think this would be an issue at all in original fic.

[jaebi-lit.livejournal.com]

On an unrelated note, what's the story behind your icon? Is it a reference to something?

[prillalar]

I'm definitely showing my age with this one. It's a Brady Bunch reference.

Jan: Well, all day long at school I hear how great Marcia is at this or how wonderful Marcia did that! Marcia, Marcia, Marcia!

It's what I think of whenever I see Yuuta. :)

[zero-sleep.livejournal.com]

I'd have to agree with ravenwoodiii, Mamushi, capitalized and not italicized. It's a nickname, however unaffectionately intended, and reading viper instead would be, to me, like reading Dry instead of Inui. Nicknames and certain characteristic forms of address (like buchou) are the only times I'll use the Japanese instead of a translation though.

[prillalar]

Yeah, I agree. It's a fine line to walk. And it's really only an issue when the show itself takes place in Japan. I wouldn't use honourifics, etc, in FMA fic.